Summary:
Prem Patel hosted Vartan Badalian, Director of U.S. Transportation Programs at the Center for Sustainable Energy, to discuss EV market trends and challenges. They highlighted the importance of dealer education through programs like Electrify IQ to boost EV sales, addressed price volatility and the rise of EV leases, and explored barriers to medium and heavy-duty fleet electrification in the Northeast. Innovations like electrified trailers and the high uptime of commercial depots were noted as solutions, while misconceptions about EVs, such as their suitability for long-distance travel, were dispelled. The conversation reflected optimism about increasing EV adoption and market growth.
Transcript:
0:10–
Prem: Hey everyone, and welcome to Episode 5 of Charging into the Future with Synop. I'm your host Prem Patel, and today we're thrilled to have Vartan Badalian as our guest. Vartan is the Director of U.S. Transportation Programs at the Center for Sustainable Energy, and previously he held a key role at the Trellis Group. We're super excited to have him today. Let's get plugged in.
Prem: Vartan, thanks for joining us today, man. How are you doing?
Vartan: Doing great. Thanks for having me, Prem.
Prem: Of course. And so I'd love to get an idea of your background for the audience. How did you find yourself in this kind of EV and transportation industry?
0:44–
Vartan: Yeah, of course. I started out always knowing I wanted to be in sustainability in some form or another. So I went to undergrad focused on sustainable energy. At that time, renewable energy was kind of becoming what the EV industry is right now. They're looking around 2013, 2015. When I graduated or upon graduation, I kind of knew I wanted to get a more advanced degree, just didn't know what. So I chose to go to law school, chose to become an attorney. For reasons I didn't understand then, but I kind of know now what led me down that path. And it was during law school that I saw what was happening in transportation happened in renewables when I was an undergrad. So transportation was just becoming something to talk about for emission reduction. Tesla had just launched a Model S after the roadster, and it was really starting to grow. And I saw the road ahead. And after that moment, I fully committed myself to transportation decarbonization. And really upon graduating law school, having some very clerkships and opportunities and just working in the space, I kind of wove through really exciting positions, really brought in my opportunities beyond transportation or beyond electrification and transportation in some form for some roles with all the industry. But now I find myself back in electrification in my current role.
1:54–
Prem: Awesome. What is your current role?
1:56–
Vartan: I'm at the Center for Sustainable Energy as a Director of U.S. Transportation Programs on the East Coast, where I lead all the state-based programs And for those who don't know CSC, it is a nonprofit that really drives the mission of decarbonization at its core. It really works with states to help administer, set up, administer, and roll out EV incentive programs and solar programs. I focus on the transportation industry on the East Coast, as I said. But we also have various other mechanisms and tools as well. Like I run, for example, a dealership certification program called Electrify IQ, which is super key. A dive into that more because dealerships as we know in this industry can be a potential unlocker of EV sales, but also can be a hurdle or a blocker of EV sales. So really find myself enjoying that work.
2:45–
Prem: Let's dig into the dealership section because I've seen a lot of dealers and hearing a lot of dealers going through this electrification process and there's some mystery around it as well. So maybe can you break down what are you seeing in the dealership area right now in terms of electrification?
3:01–
Vartan: Yeah. Happening, especially now, I think more so than years before. Obviously there are some pockets of the U.S. That are more advanced than others, and that equates to dealerships being more advanced in their knowledge and education about EVs. Various OEMs are more advanced than others, which incentivizes their dealers to become more educated. But generally speaking, there's still opportunity for dealers to get more educated and feel more comfortable about talking about EVs, because historically, as we're seeing until this day, I think we still see certain dealerships incentivize buys or push what they've always sold, which is internal combustion engine vehicles, easier to sell that. Even though electric vehicles now are comparable with gas vehicles and there are good opportunities to sell, to sell vehicles, the right range is there, and the right charging infrastructure is around at this point already. So the opportunity is there for dealers to sell. I think they're not comfortable enough, which is what we decided to do. So we partnered with NADA, the National Dealers Association, and we kind of built this software tool from the ground up called Electric By IQ, which is designed 90 minutes entirely online, super quick and easy to really educate dealers. I actually took it myself to see what it's all about. And I learned a few things given being in the industry this long. So it's definitely useful. And we're seeing as dealerships roll through that certification and get certified, we're seeing testimonials come back that it's helped them sell EVs faster, giving them just overall confidence to sell, which I think is the key here. If you don't feel confident talking about something, you're not going to... The person receiving that information is not going to be confident in the product itself. So it's definitely been a change-maker, but there's more room to be done even in Electrify IQ. So we have a ways to go until we educate dealerships. Yeah.
4:36–
Vartan: And education is one piece, you know, in the news in the past six, eight months, there have been talks about just volatility in prices of electric vehicles, you know, seeing what happened with Tesla. Is that a fear for dealerships as well, that they're going to get vehicles on their lot and next thing you know, the price you're going to drop and they're now stuck in a financial situation that doesn't make sense for them? I certainly think that's probably a thought on their perspectives. But at the end of the day, also, if they're getting the vehicles from their OEMs to their lots, then that's a secondary thought, right? Because the vehicles are coming, and they can sell them. If you hold onto them for too long, then that becomes a problem. Better interest to sell them quickly and get them off the lots so people can have them in their hands. The secondary used vehicle market is a whole different conversation for EVs. And we've seen volatility there. The price dropped, as you just mentioned. Bringing down the used vehicle market. But I think then we're seeing data around how leases, EV leases are up significantly to that exact point as well. So dealerships should incentivize and work on EV leases then because we've seen a huge skyrocket there. And also leases still can take advantage of the EV tax credits that exist at the federal level and some state levels. So it's a win-win-win for the consumer. It's a win for the dealership and a win for the OEM just to get vehicles The used vehicle market can take care of the rest for itself like that.
5:51–
Prem: So you cover the Northeast transportation sector. What are you seeing in some trends right now, specifically with commercial transportation in the Northeast and maybe overall across the country in commercial transportation right now?
6:02 —
Vartan: Generally speaking, I think we're seeing that the fleet space is both slowing down from the EV adoption, and becoming more cautious. But I think it's a stronger value proposition than for the individual consumer because you depot charging infrastructure, if you're talking about medium and heavy-duty, more reliable charging infrastructure experiences, you can control the entire ownership experience for the vehicle. And as we're seeing now, more options are coming up for medium and heavy-duty fleets. Light duty has always been great for some time now, the adoption, sales vehicles, pharmaceutical vehicles, those are all light duty sedans and trucks and those have never been better before than right now. So we're seeing a lot of adoption there, I think, but the medium and heavy duty has been slower, but we're picking up because of what I just said. It's just making sense. Now just the financials have to square out, meaning the ownership experience has to just be right. And sometimes with the vehicle's range that currently exists for some trucks being 250 or 300 miles, you really can't have just a vehicle that does just one battery route because it's not practical from an economics perspective. So, and then charging. I've spoken to a lot of fleets generally in my career who have said, that while the vehicle technology is right, we actually cannot justify incorporating charging dwell times into the business model because that is just too much of an economic hit. Even if we bake into drivers taking their rest and so forth, it's just not a financial move right now that they can adopt. So I think we're seeing a lot of kind of interest is there to decarbonize fleets, but the financials have to align, which I think is one thing I want to kind of bring up, which came to my mind I think that is where we're entering into the space for fleet adoption and electrification, is that financials become the first conversation point and sustainability is a secondary effect of it. And one example of that is range energy. I think they've popped up in a lot of people's focus. They are basically electrifying trailers for trucks in a very intelligent way. Their CEO and founder is a former Tesla employee who launched the Model 3, so he's very much engineering electrification focus. And that business model, I think speaks to what the industry needs to have more of, which is the financials of electrifying the trailer reduces the drag weight of the trailer, which reduces the fuel costs and the fuel needs, which in turn is better for sustainability as well. But the financial mechanism is the primary reason why someone would adopt an electrified trailer, but it has a benefit to the environment. So I think that's where we're heading as we kind of wait for medium heavy-duty trucks to really pick up traction.
8:33–
Prem: Yep. Dollars and cents and the overall total cost of ownership for these vehicles. Outside of upfitting trailers, do you think we're going to get to a point where prices of vehicles are going to come down, prices of chargers are going to get down, and you're going to see a faster TCO reduction compared to the internal combustion and diesel counterparts in the space today? I think we have to.
8:54–
Vartan: It's inevitable for technology adoption to bring down those costs. It's just a matter of when it's going to happen. But if it happens, as for sure, in my perspective, I think everyone. We're seeing it on light duty. I think we're inching closer and closer to, I believe it was 100-kilowatt battery capacity. That was like the comparison between ICE vehicles and electric vehicles for sedans and trucks. That same evolution will come to the medium and heavy-duty space. It'll just take a little bit longer because we started out a little bit later for trucks, but it's going to happen. And once the vehicle's price is as comparable to a diesel or gasoline vehicle, sticker on paper from the beginning, then the TCOs are even far greater in the ownership experience because then you have significantly fewer maintenance costs, less fuel costs, so it just becomes way more practical of a solution and option to have, which is around now driving down the cost as much as we can. And I think a lot of the incentives will help in that space. We're seeing a lot of government announcements come out to help support electrification. The one problem I have right now is that I think everyone focusing on California and fewer investments happening in other parts of the US to decarbonize trucks. But even there, I think we're now seeing some people kind of speaking about, well, what about everywhere else besides California and to incentivize EV truck adoption there. So it's just a matter of the journey ahead. We're losing time from a client perspective, but we're making progress. If I look back half a year or two a year ago, we're definitely further ahead now than we ever were.
10:24–
Prem: Yeah. We're seeing LCFS programs that are really well known in California and the West Coast start making their way to the Northeast over time. And then you layer on certain things like smart charging, of course, carbon credits, of course, incentives like the IRA and policy to really start lowering the TCO. I think we're heading in the right direction. Fleets are starting to recognize that. Let's take also your background and just see what's happening on the residential public side and see what's happening on the commercial side. I want to talk about charging. And there's a Bloomberg article that came out two months ago that One in five public chargers are usually down. And that's not a good sign for this industry, especially when you look at uptime and this idea of uptime. I know there are many definitions of uptime. And now let's take a look at a commercial depot. A commercial depot is usually around 98% uptime. And so there's a stark difference between the public charging infrastructure uptime and the commercial depot uptime. What's your take on what's happening in the public sector right now when it comes to charging and making sure that a consumer can go to a charger and it's ready and available and ready to charge your vehicle successfully?
11:28–
Vartan: Yeah, that stark difference I think points to one obvious point, which is that the fleets have a financial interest to keep the chargers up and running constantly, which is why it's driving that huge success rate. The same needs to equate to the public infrastructure side where historically maybe there's been less investment in maintenance and ensuring stations are kind of operational through and through with high uptime and more interest in just the deploying and getting dots on a map to show growth of the industry. I think that same kind of fleet approach that we just said is what maybe Tesla has done for his entire lifetime with supercharger deployment, which historically has been very high on uptime and reliability and is known for that. I think they've dedicated financial dollars to ensure that stations are operational and running on a per site basis, because there's a financial interest, because they were locked for their just vehicles. So they had to have these stations for their vehicles to charge and a proprietary technology. Actually, I mean, this is a very, very personal point to me because I've dedicated a lot of my career to this because I think without adequate, reliable, e-fuel charging in a public setting, we won't actually see the adoption S-curve that we actually want in the timeline that we want it to. We're definitely seeing a lot of improvement. I actually just came back from BIRSCH24, the climate tech conference where ICF Climate Center and Center for Sustainable Energy and myself and Stacey Noble, co-hosted a charging workshop on improving uptime and reliability for the public network. We actually held the same workshop two years ago at Verge, and we did it again with the right folks, Tesla, the joint office of Android Interpretation, Electrify America was there, BMW, and so forth and so forth, to really talk about this issue and see what we've done. And a lot of it just comes down to, I mean, it's a whole host of things. I can't probably talk about it right now in one answer, so we can dive into it further, but it is really about ensuring redundancy, enough stations at a location to sure if one goes down, people could still charge. It's around just being thoughtful about putting dollars to maintenance as opposed to putting dollars to deployment of new stations. So all those things, but without adequately having stations up and running always, we won't see the S curve on adoption.
13:30–
Prem: You could have a whole episode speaking of uptime, even the definition of uptime and how people will define it. And how do you define uptime?
13:38–
Vartan: I mean, there's a whole host of ways to define it, right? I think depends on, I don't want to say what I believe is firmly right, but I think if you look at the entire site, personally, I think we need to have eight to 16 chargers per site for DC fast charging. You look at the whole site and then there should be an uptime measurement based off the entire location. So if you look at 97% is what you want to go for, then there should only be 3% on a per site basis that are down at any given point in time because that redundancy will protect it. Now that's a evolutionary point because I don't think we should be striving for on a per location basis to have certain charges is always broken. We should strive to have charges constantly up and running and we should be achieving 98%, 99%, even a hundred. But this is the real world and this is hardware that has to communicate with the vehicle. And there's obviously interplays here that are complex. So I think on a per site basis is probably smart for right now, but I know this, that varies from charging company to charging company, from standard to standard and from the joint office to others. So it is a rather complex problem. To address, but I think we have examples of successes that have been working for some time now. And I constantly point to initially Tesla and now Rivian, both have really strong uptime on their networks. Rivian is a much smaller network, but did it because Tesla did it and it worked well for them and they couldn't rely on the public network. There's a financial interest to keep these stations running, which historically has not been the case because charging companies have been given tax dollars and just general funding to deploy less interest on keeping decisions running. But I think we're seeing that change now happen. Nevi is a good solution there, driving that conversation forward, collecting data. Hopefully that data gets actually analyzed and reported out. And then companies that have not met the standard do not continue to receive funding. That is my hope that happens. But it is a complex one. Actually, one point that came to my mind just even at Birch that came up in conversation is that now that we're seeing such more adoption in EVs and more vehicles on the road, the financials actually penciling out for people of our companies, charging companies, to really ensuring maintenance of these stations, because now there's a financial interest to keep them going, which I think maybe two, three, four years ago wasn't the case because there were less EVs on the road. My personal opinion, charging companies should have maintained the stations as if they were vehicles on the road two, three, four years ago, because now we have a bad taste in our mouth, and to really curb that bad taste is going to take some time.
15:59–
Prem: There are a lot of “bad” tastes in people's mouths sometimes around EVs. That you see in the news, especially sometimes in the cold weather that, you know, I can't drive my EV in the cold weather. And you know, there are a lot of that's untrue as well. What are some common misconceptions? Maybe bring up one common misconception about the EV industry that you'd like to clear up here.
16:18–
Vartan: I think the biggest one is that people think they can't drive a vehicle long distance, or they think they can't go on a road trip with the vehicle. They really don't conceptualize, from the conversations that I have with individuals, that a vehicle right now today that you purchase, which has 250 to do 300 miles minimum is actually adequate enough for your daily commute and your potential road trip commute. That is actually not the case. Now it's a different experience depending on which vehicle you pick, where you charge, with which provider you charge, which is a little bit of a learning curve that people need to accept and learn if they want to. But the notion that the vehicle and the industry and the charging infrastructure is not built out enough right now for me to have my life is just not true anymore. For example, I mean, this constant gets mentioned, which is unfortunate, but the Tesla is the primary example people kind of leverage. But if you go down the Tesla route, it really is a far better driving experience than a internal combustion engine vehicle. It is actually mentally, in quote unquote, like brainless. It is really efficiently designed for you to just drive and get to where you need to go, plug it in charge. The same is being built out for a non Tesla vehicle in terms of route optimization and route navigation with charging spots in the route. So it really is actually a pretty simple and far better user experience than going to a gas station where historically you do not want to be at. In my prior role, this made me think about, I was actually writing at Greenbrace, which is now called Trellis Group. And one of the articles I wrote about, which is why are we holding on to the gas station experience? Why is that such a fond memory for Americans? Because historically, or even if you just look at the gas station experience, it is not a pleasant one.
17:56–
Vartan: You do not want to stay there more than four or five minutes because of the fumes. Just the ambiance is not great. It is not a pleasant experience to have. Whereas if you turn now to the charging experience, while the wait time is potentially 15 to 20 minutes, the experience is far greater. There is no fumes. The overall atmosphere of the space, while maybe sometimes simpler than a gas station, usually does have convenience stores, clean bathrooms and whatnot. And you do naturally just want to take time to rest. And it is just a far better resting experience. So I think this mentality people need to kind of get over, but they will not get over it unless they experience it for themselves. Word of mouth only can go so far. They need to actually be in an EV, take that trip, drive it, and see what it's really like, Completely agree. Really, really agree on that point. What do you think is the most exciting success story in EVs over the past two years? I think the fact that we have so many vehicle options now that are above 300 miles. I would say successes on the charging infrastructure side is great. I'm going to say two, charging and on the vehicle side. The vehicle side, we have a whole bunch of EVs now that exist that are in the 30 to $40,000 range. Pre incentives, post incentives, you're even pushing that further down that are just great for all types of consumers. And we have not had that. I remember when I first started my career, we were at 1% EV adoption or less than 1%. And now we're pushing 10, little bit past that potentially at this point. So the market is definitely growing and this notion that it's stalling or consumer sales are stalling is not true and there's data around that that can be seen. So adoption because the vehicles are there is great. On the charging side, I think having Tesla's charging standard open up to all of their OEMs and all of their vehicles is a tremendous opportunity now that we're going to see first with these adapters. If those of you who don't know, Tesla has rolled out their charging standard to other this year into next, it's really more about adapters and then come integration of the charging standard built into the vehicle. So no adapter, you just go to a supercharger, you plug in like any car, like any Tesla vehicle, and you start charging seamlessly. I think that's going to be huge. Now there's things that need to be squared away with like all vehicles having the port on the right side, the cables reaching, cars not taking up more than one spot, which right now is kind of happening for like Ford F-150s have to take up two spots, for example, and so for it. Once that all gets squared away, I think we're going to see a massive spike. Consumers will start realizing that they're getting access to this incredible charging network that has historically been incredible. And I think Tesla will continue to keep it the way that it has been. I think adoption is going to rise. I think that is a massive success story, which as we start seeing it kind of roll out, it's going to increase adoption.
Prem: Amazing. Vartan, if someone wants to speak with you about the Center for Sustainable Energy, how can they reach and what's the best way to do so?
Vartan: Find me on LinkedIn. I'm there. Type my name, shoot me a message, and we can chat.
At Synop we’re already looking forward to the big plans we have in store for 2025, but those wouldn’t be possible without all the incredible achievements we’ve seen in 2024. Before diving into year-end festivities, we wanted to take a moment to reflect on all we’ve been able to achieve thanks to the hard work of our team, our partners, and our clients.
The year was chockfull of exciting announcements, each one a testament to how the Synop team is always looking for opportunities to innovate and meet the needs and challenges of our clients.
Just a few weeks into the year, we launched our EV Fleet Home Charging Reimbursement tool, which automates and simplifies EV charging reimbursements using data-agnostic tracking, making fleet management efficient and hassle-free, especially for those mixed-fuel fleets who are also managing fuel cards.
Shortly after, we announced SynopLink, making it possible to integrate onsite DERs with cloud-based technology for real-time management. With SynopLink, fleets can ensure continuous operation of commercial EV charging microgrids by preventing system overloads, automating fault recovery, and enabling sustainable energy use
Spring brought the debut of our Fleet Driver Mobile App and Managed Access Charging capabilities. With it, operators can equip their drivers with in-app RFID cards, making authorization and instant payments even easier. Additionally, drivers can use the app to discover chargers across their network, match available chargers based on needs, manage charging from the app, and save payment information. What’s even more exciting is that the app allows fleets to extend private charging depot access to commercial partners, setting their own energy prices and adding revenue through charger monetization.
This summer, we were proud to receive our SOC 2 Type 2 Certification, proving our ability to implement and maintain robust security measures continuously, and underscoring our dedication to safeguarding customer information and maintaining the integrity of our services.
We were also excited to share our V2G Summer Series, where we were able to bring our community regular updates on all the energy we were helping to bring back to the grid on the hot summer days. By the end of summer, we transacted 26 MWh back to the grid, or about enough to power over 21,000 homes for an hour. Though we’re expecting to see our final-year V2G numbers stay consistent with what we saw in 2023, we’re excited to share that in 2024 we added 5 more states, tested on 2 more EVSEs, and added 1 more vehicle OEM, so we are seeing this solution scale and anticipate much larger numbers in 2025 (stay tuned for more V2G updates from us in Q1!).
And finally, we ended the year on a high note, recently announcing our partnership with Bus2Grid. Together, we will be equipping 14 school districts across Illinois with electric buses and intelligent charging infrastructure that include onsite solar and battery storage integrations. Funding for this project has been made possible by a $15 million Renew America’s Schools Grant through the Department of Energy.
Industry events offer such important opportunities to learn, share, and network with the best in the business, and this year was no exception.
The spring brought the EV Charging Summit & Expo in Las Vegas, where our Head of Business Development, Shana Patadia, discussed the need for maximizing uptime across hardware and software components to ensure uninterrupted fleet operations. She advocated for standardization and seamless integration between software and hardware providers to simplify operations and enhance user experience.
Similarly, our CCO, Mark Braby, participated as a speaker at the Advanced Clean Transport (ACT) Expo on a panel addressing the transformative potential of AI-enabled charging software in the EV industry. After attending, he wrote up a blog post summarizing his key takeaways from the event.
Then in November, Shana once again hit the stage at the Fleet Forward Conference alongside Sawatch Labs and the City of Edmonton to discuss best practices for keeping fleets powered through cold weather.
We were also extremely excited to co-host the second annual Amped Up Affair: eMobility Happy Hour in Williamsburg during NY Climate Week along with some incredible partners – Curo, Obvious Ventures, Prologis, and Flash. We were also joined by Newlab, itselectric, Voltpost, and Streamline Capital, bringing together a stellar lineup of innovators and change-makers. With over 100 attendees, it was an evening of collaboration, inspiration, and acceleration toward the future of sustainable transportation.
Finally, we were honored to win the Global Innovation Award at EXPO2024 of STARTUP AUTOBAHN powered by Plug and Play thanks to our work with ZF Group. By integrating our software into ZF’s cloud platform, SCALAR, over 350,000 customers are able to manage their vehicle operations from a single dashboard. This was a collaborative effort between our engineering and product teams, and we’re grateful for the recognition of the robust charging and energy management system we’ve built within SCALAR.
We’re always pushing ourselves to learn and grow at Synop, and sharing that knowledge means the industry as a whole learns and grows along with us. To that end, we’re proud of the work we’ve put behind the Charging into the Future Podcast, hosted by our Head of Marketing, Prem Patel and featuring experts from both within the Synop team and from trusted partners.
In the fall, we were excited to debut our Cost Savings Case Study, putting concrete numbers on the savings made possible through our energy management capabilities. If you haven’t already given it a read, you should, but spoiler alert, we were able to reduce energy costs for one European operator by 30% through smart charging automation based on real-time energy prices.
In other media highlights, Head of Business Development, Shana Patadia, wrote an op-ed for Smart Energy International exploring how a software-supported sharing economy can address the financial and logistical barriers to commercial EV adoption in the U.S.
We also saw interviews with our leadership team in several publications and podcasts including The Fully Charged Podcast, FreightWaves, Forbes, Hackernoon, and TechBrew, among others.
It’s amazing all that can happen in a year, and we’re excited to keep the momentum going in 2025. A massive thanks to our team, partners, and clients for their unwavering support and collaboration. Cheers to a great year and wishing everyone a wonderful holiday season!
Summary:
Connor Whaley, Head of Strategic Partnerships at FuSE, discussed the benefits of Clean Fuels programs, which offer significant revenue through, ie LCFS credit. Fuse helps companies enroll in these programs, which pay companies for operating electric equipment. Revenue can range from $700 to $20,000 annually per piece of equipment. Whaley highlighted the upcoming changes in California's LCFS amendments, including the expansion of the FCI program to include private chargers. He also addressed the Advanced Clean Fleets regulation, which mandates fleet electrification by 2045, currently held up in court.
Prem Patel (0:08)
Hey everyone, welcome to episode four of our podcast, Charging Into The Future with Synop. I'm your host, Prem Patel, and today we have Connor Whaley, Head of Strategic Partnerships at FuSE, an organization and platform that makes it easier for EV fleets to harness credit and clean fuel programs like LCFS. We're going to be discussing clean fuel programs, overall generating significant revenue from LCS credits and a topic on everyone's mind, Advanced Clean Fuels (ACF) regulation. We have an exciting episode. Let's get plugged in.
Hey, Connor, thanks for joining us today. How are you doing?
Conner Whaley (0:40)
Hey, it's going. Well, I always like talking to you.
Prem Patel (0:42)
Likewise, let's start off with your background. Can you share how you found yourself in this EV and energy ecosystem?
Conner Whaley (0:48)
Yeah, you know, I've been in the EV space since college. So I've really only been in the EV space since, you know, I started working. I in college, I had, you know, very typical. I had the thought when I was graduating, trying to figure out, you know, what do I want to do, where do I want to go? And my biggest thought was, what can I do that would make, like, the biggest impact? And I was thinking about it for six, seven months, and I came to the conclusion that actual power generation, renewable power, was what I wanted to do. And I was looking at wind and solar. At the time, the cost was starting to become more and more competitive. So like, you know, I think that would be very useful to get into, and I found it really satisfying. But actually fairly quickly, outside of college, I found myself in the EV space. So I actually cut my teeth in drive train development. So I was working on drive trains for classic vehicles, and doing development for new technologies. And it was a really exciting time we were working on, you know, technology that at the time EVs was something really new, and people were just starting to realize how high quality EV can be. The experience of driving an EV could really outperform its internal combustion counterparts in almost every meaningful metric. Even at the time range was starting to get better. It was very quiet, very fast. People were really coming to the conclusion that, hey, EVs are really an alternative that I should consider. So it was a really exciting time, and then going into the pandemic, you know, a lot of things in the industry started changing, and I actually found myself here at Fuse, and we kind of went from developing the technology to actually trying to implement the technology by helping finance it. And that was a really good transition for me, because those are really the two areas that I find the most interesting is, you know, making sure that we can build it, but really making sure that people can actually use it on the light duty and the heavy duty side, that's what I've been really excited about. So that's kind of how I got here.
Prem Patel (2:49)
Awesome background. Let's keep this going. And can you dig into your current company now, fuse,
Conner Whaley (2:54)
In a nutshell, fuse helps companies enroll into Clean Fuels programs. That's that's in a nutshell, what we do. And you know, kind of have to talk about Clean Fuels programs to kind of know the benefit. Clean Fuels programs are significantly different from traditional grants, rebates, incentive programs that most people are familiar with. These programs are state run programs here in the US, and they pay companies every 90 days as long as they operate their electric equipment. These programs are intended to offset the carbon emissions associated with the transportation sector. So these programs that started in California in 2011 they started moving to Oregon, to Washington. New Mexico was starting to open up a program. And these programs are intended to offset transportation emissions, so we help companies get access to these programs, because again, the enrollment process is a lot different. The way these programs are structured is that they're actually funded by oil companies, so they're not actually publicly funded. They're required by the government agencies. They're required by law for gas and diesel companies to participate if they want to sell gas and diesel in those states. And they participate by purchasing credits, these kinds of carbon credits that some people are familiar with, a portion to how much gas and diesel they sell. So the more gas and diesel they sell, the more credits they have to purchase in order to be compliant. And they purchase these credits directly from owners and operators of electric equipment. There's a biofuels program, or biofuels included in the programs as well, but we focus very specifically on the EV provisions. So anyone who operates a level two charge a DC fast charger. Forklifts, refrigerated transport, anything really that has a battery in wheels can generate credits every time you plug them in, and you sell those credits directly to Shell arco BP, these oil companies that are looking to purchase them. So you know, it's a very unique structure on how to actually invest into these. Fees. And you know, anyone can enroll. There's no approved vendor lists for the equipment. There's no eligibility requirements beyond just operating it for a commercial purpose. But you can get these chargers into the program and generate ongoing, long, lasting revenue, and we help manage that entire process, because the flip side of getting paid every 90 days is that you have to re-enroll every 90 days, and a lot of people don't really want to do that, and you have to figure out how to sell these credits. In some cases, you know, these companies, they're looking to buy, you know, 50,000 credits at a time, not 50 or 100 so liquidity becomes an issue. So we help handle that entire process. Soup to nuts for monitoring their energy consumption data. We handle their application. We actually bundle the credits across our portfolio. We can sell them in bulk to these regulated entities, and then we remit payment back to our customers, so we handle that entire process for them. How many
Prem Patel (5:53)
Which states or regions have these Clean Fuel programs today?
Conner Whaley (5:57)
There's three in the US and two in Canada. There's a new program coming out in New Mexico. They just passed their Clean Fuels regulation bill, and they're in the process of developing their regulation. We're actually involved in that, but we are waiting for New Mexico to launch theirs. There's a number of other states that are starting to pass bills or introduce bills to implement their own Clean Fuels programs, but at the moment, California, Oregon, Washington, all have almost identical programs. They're all almost identical in how they function. And Canada has two, one in British Columbia, and then there's a federal Canadian program that covers every province and territory
Prem Patel (6:34)
Got it. Can you give me an example of the amount of revenue that a fleet can make through these programs,
Conner Whaley (6:41)
The amount of revenue is significant. Companies generate credits at different rates depending on the type of equipment that they have, and that directly translates to how much revenue they have. You can for, say, a level two charger, if you used quite frequently, you could get seven, $800 potentially up to $1,000 for these highly utilized level two chargers. If you have a DC fast charger, you can get, you know, several $1,000 per year, depending on how much it's used. And if you have off road equipment or heavy duty equipment, you can generate between, you know, a few 100 bucks to several $1,000 per vehicle. And this is every single year. You get paid quarterly in the US programs. So you get paid every 90 days for as long as that, you know, equipment's operating, you're going to continue to get that revenue. So that compounds over the life of that piece of equipment, you know, pretty quickly. So if you're looking at, let's say, a piece of equipment in British Columbia, they have very high credit prices. So you could get, you know, $10,000, $15,000, $20,000 for a heavy duty truck every single year if you operate it in Canada. So it depends on where that piece of equipment is located and what those credit prices are in that state. But in most cases, when credit prices are decent. It can be very, very lucrative.
Prem Patel (8:02)
Can EV fleets consider this as a real way to lower their TCO, their total cost of ownership?
Conner Whaley (8:07)
Yep, it's kind of this best kept secret of the industry where you know not many people know that these programs are applicable to EVs, because typically, most people when they think about low carbon fuel standards or Clean Fuels programs. They typically think of biofuels. They think of renewable diesel, renewable natural gas. And these programs are just as applicable to EVs. And you know, when you start talking to folks, I talk to a lot of different fleets that have a lot of different equipment, and they go, Wow. Actually, I didn't know that this money was available. And you know, there's a number of unique advantages to the funding as well. So you can't absolutely reduce their TCO for that piece of equipment, but because it's privately funded, it's technically funded by oil companies, so there's no public dollars involved. It's really up to the customer on how they spend the money. So if they're operating charging equipment, they're operating EVs, it's really up to them on how they appropriate those funds for their electrification process. So you know, you can absolutely put it towards the TCO of the charger that, you know, generated the credits, you could offset your, you know, electricity costs. But you can also put that money towards new vehicle purchases. You can put that towards writing incentives for your clients. There's a lot of different ways that you can use this funding, outside of, you know, just the TCO so it gives them the flexibility on how they want to spend the money.
Prem Patel (9:32)
Yeah, thanks for that background. From what I understand of the credit market, the more credits that go into the market, the price of the credit goes down, and so as more fleets are electrified, more fleets participate in these clean fuel programs. Do you see being less lucrative over time? And what is carb and other entities doing to make sure they're incentivizing electric fleet owners to still participate in these clean fuel programs?
Conner Whaley (9:56)
This is an important question, because it goes towards how the. Mechanics of these programs. So all Clean Fuels programs have supply and demand forces involved. You know, it's not a set amount per credit guaranteed by the program. It's dependent on how many credits are being purchased and how many credits are being sold at any given time that will dictate the credit price. So you do get fluctuations in, you know how much a credit is worth. So California credits, you can't sell your California Credit into Oregon. So there's completely separate markets, and you'll get different credit prices. So Oregon credit prices right now are close to $30 California $65 you go to BC, the latest transactions are close to, like, $350. There's a very large range because of these programs, they have their own markets, they have their own ecosystem of demand and supply. So as companies generate more credits, and there's, you know, a dip in demand, you will get a decrease in credit prices for those you know, for that time period, and we saw that in California, California, you know, credit prices were at 200 $210 at some points. And what happened is the pandemic hit, and demand for credits decreased because no one was driving as much gas and diesel. Demand decreased, so they have to purchase to offset their gas and diesel sales. So if gas and diesel sales go down, they don't have to purchase as many credits. Now, at the same time, you have a lot of renewable diesel production going, coming online at the same exact time, so you have this huge increase in supply credits, a decrease in demand for credits. In California, prices went from that high of $200 down to, I think the lowest was like $400 or $40 so it's a huge, huge difference, and that happened in the span of 18 months. So that was a big change in, you know, how these markets operate. The same thing happened in Oregon. Prices were at, you know, $160 now they're at $30. So there's a lot of these fluctuations that can happen, but the long term position in these programs is that credit prices are expected to increase and stay at a relatively high level. And the reason why is there are mechanisms included in these programs to decrease or increase the strictness of the targets every single year, making it harder and harder to generate credits and increasing the amount of credits that have to be purchased. So the way these programs operate, really, over the long term, incentivize companies to, you know, decrease their carbon emissions and therefore generate more credits. But there's also an increasing demand for credits. Oil companies, over time, have to purchase more and more credits in order to stay compliant. Over time, credit prices aren't expected to be at where they are today. They're not expected to be at $40 or $50 or $60 expected to go up to, you know, $100, $110, $115 something that's actually going to make it significantly more lucrative for companies. And over time, certain fuels will not become eligible anymore. There's a target every single year on how clean or dirty your fuel should be. If you're above that target, you have to buy credits. If you're under that target, and you generate credits, that target decreases every single year, so it becomes harder and harder for these fuels to generate as many credits as they used to. So really, at the end of the day, credit prices are expected to increase, but really the fuels that are going to be left generating those credits are going to be hydrogen, electricity and ultra clean fuels.
Prem Patel (13:47)
Yeah,I'm sure fleets are very happy to hear that. Connor, thanks for sharing that. And so talk to me about the new legislation or amendment that came out with LCFS from what you said, is anything tied into that, or is that completely different?
Conner Whaley (13:59)
No, if that's actually tied in directly to, you know, what's happening in the market. So the amendment process that you're talking about is in California. California is the largest Clean Fuels program in North America. It is the, you know, 600 pound gorilla, and they saw that decrease in credit price over the pandemic. And because of the pandemic, they've pushed out the amendments that they typically do every few years to update the program, to fix any issues that may have come up, or introduce mechanisms to improve the program. And this most recent amendment has been going on since, you know, December 2023 it's been about a year, and it's going into effect in 2025 and the amendment is going to be making some big, sweeping changes in the EV provisions for these programs. The biggest one is starting next year, that declining standard that I was talking about that's going to drop 9% next year. 9% is huge. Huge, huge gap between where it started and, you know, this year and next year. So that decrease is going to happen one time in 2025 and that's going to significantly impact the amount of credits that are generated by certain fuels and the amount of credits that have to be purchased for that year. So it's really meant to be kind of a shock to the system to kind of boost credit prices back up to where they want it. There's also going to be a ratcheting mechanism included, where if certain credit prices dip below a certain amount or amount of credits generated out of piece demand, they can ratchet down that target again. So multiple stages, so to say, can happen, to monitor and manage that credit price, to again, make it lucrative enough for people to consider electrifying, they're going to be introducing a number of things. And the final kind of major implementation on the EV side is that they're expanding what's called the FCI program. It stands for the fast charging infrastructure program where certain DC fast chargers in California can generate guaranteed credits, and that's intended to incentivize companies to invest into DC fast charging, where, you know the payout may not make sense right now because people aren't using that charger, but if they make The investment, they can get guaranteed credits to reduce their risk. That program is being expanded and modified next year to allow private charging included as well. Up until now, only public DC Chargers were included, but they're expanding that to private charging so you can get, say, a private DC charger above 50 kilowatts somewhere in California, if you meet the requirements, you can get guaranteed crediting for a period of 10 years. And that's a huge, huge improvement over where it was, and it makes it significantly easier for people to invest into infrastructure that they wouldn't have done before because they didn't have that guarantee on you know how many kilowatt hours they're going to use, how many credits they're going to generate? It takes that variable out of the equation and reduces risk for them. So there's a number of major changes that are coming for that Pro for the California Program, and there's going to be knocked on effects into Oregon and Washington as well. Washington's adopting similar regulatory amendments in their process Oregon typically follow suit as well, so there's going to be a lot of changes. And from what I can see from the end side, it's nothing but positive.
Prem Patel (17:30)
That's great news. Now I want to leverage your knowledge of the space and Legislation in California, and you may know where I'm going next with this, but talk to me about ACF, advanced Clean Fuels regulation. What is it and what is happening right now?
Conner Whaley (17:43)
You know, outside of the LCFS, because that's our bread and butter, outside of LCFS questions, the advanced clean fleet regulation, we get more questions on that than pretty much any other topic, because it's a huge thing for California fleets. It is making sweeping changes, because the advanced clean fleet regulation is a regulation from the California Air Resources Board. For those outside of California that may not be familiar, the ACF rule, or advanced Clean Fleets, is a regulation that's going to require California fleets, both public and private, to transition their fleet to 100% renewable, or 100% zero emission by 2045 and it passed last year, and it was going into effect gen one this year, 2024 and effectively what it requires fleets to do is to transition their fleet to 100% zero emission using multiple different methods and different processes, but they have to start electrifying this year, according to the regulation, and it affects three different kinds of fleets. There's public fleets, so both state and federal agencies are all beholden to the rule of high priority fleets. So private fleets, if you have 50 vehicles or more, or $50 million in revenue or more, you are considered a high priority fleet, and the ACF rule affects you. And the last one is drayage fleets. So anyone operating outside of the ports, Port of Stockton, Port of LA, Port of Long Beach, you're operating a drainage fleet. This affects you as well. So it's a huge amount of vehicles that are kind of included under the umbrella of the advanced clean fleet regulation, and you have to start transitioning through a few different ways. One way is for the high priority fleets, is to essentially, I call it the cold turkey method, where you just stop buying any gas or diesel vehicles today, and then you start transitioning your fleet once those vehicles age out. So if your vehicle is 18 years or older, or it meets, I think it's 800,000 miles on the odometer, you have to scrap it, and you have to replace it with a zero emission vehicle, because it's considered end of life. And then you just. Continue that until 2045 until 100% of your vehicles are electrified. Or you can take the milestone option, where a certain percentage of the vehicle types that you have. So if you kind of break out your fleet into different buckets, you know, how many box trucks do you have? How many specialty vehicles? How many sleeper cabs, how many day cabs? You break out the types of vehicles that you have, and then you have to replace a certain portion of them every single year to meet certain requirements and certain milestones. So you know, by 2027 you have to have 10% of your box trucks. By 2030 you have to have 10% of your sleeper cabs electric. You have to meet these milestones, and then you just do that until 2045. That's really how you comply with the advanced clean fleet regulation. If you're a fleet in California and on the public side, they have it even harder, where 100% of their new vehicle purchases have to be 100% zero emission by 2027 so if you could buy EVs or hydrogen on the public side, you're going to have to start buying a lot of them, you know, relatively quickly. So that's the advanced clean fleet regulation. It affects drainage fleets as well. So you know, by 2035 if a drainage fleet is operating California, 100% of the vehicles have to be electric. You have to meet that milestone objective, or the cold turkey method. You have to electrify your vehicles. And after 2035 no internal combustion vehicles are going to be allowed on port property. So you know, when you're talking about these three groups of companies or three entities, that's a lot of compliance that they have to kind of meet in a relatively short amount of time. So that's the advanced clean fleet regulation. And some people, you know, everyone seems to have an opinion on the advanced clean fleet rule. That's why this is the regulation that everyone's starting to talk about,
Prem Patel (21:57)
And currently it's held up in court?
Conner Whaley (22:00)
Yes, yes, it is, yeah.
Prem Patel (22:02)
Do you have any idea of when this might be resolved, or when we'll get an answer from EPA and CARB?
Conner Whaley (22:09)
I would love to say that I have a crystal ball on that, but I don't think really anyone knows, other than the EPA talking about the lawsuits. You know, this is very controversial. This is, you know, a very sweeping, a very comprehensive rule. And the timelines are, you know, very fast to be able to comply with this. You have to start converting very quickly, and you have to start now if you are to meet those requirements. So there's a number of groups in California that are, you know, submitting lawsuits to prevent ACF from, you know, becoming law. It's already passed. It's just not enforced right now, because you're going through the process of going through these lawsuits. But in particular, they're waiting on a waiver from the EPA. The EPA has authority over, you know, the Environmental Equality standards for the US at a federal level, because of the Clean Air Act, states can enact different standards, stricter standards, than the federal rules. And California does that quite often because, you know, we had really bad air quality for a while. You know, California has a lot of incentive to enact stricter standards than the typical federal standard, but in order to do that, they have to get a waiver from the EPA to prove that you know, the air quality or the environmental quality is significantly worse in California, and that this rule is necessary. So they had to submit a waiver to the EPA or submit an application to the EPA to get that waiver in place. That happened earlier this year, and we just had the first public comment period for the EPA on the advanced clean fleet wave. And I think that it made waves is kind of an understatement. Last time I checked, there were 40,000 comments on the regulation just in that one public comment period. It lasted from like seven in the morning to 10. It was a really long process just to be able to get everyone's feedback on it. And there's a lot of different opinions of whether or not this should be granted or not. And that's where it is right now. The public comment period, you know, has to go through, and then EPA is going to deliberate. They may have another public comment period, but really it's up to the EPA now on whether or not they're going to allow the waiver or not, and everyone's just waiting with bated breath.
Prem Patel (24:35)
Yeah, I'm sure. Connor, you shared so much information that can be impactful for fleets in this space. How can they get in contact with you to learn more,
Conner Whaley (24:43)
If any company on this podcast or any public agency really is interested in learning more, go to our website. Our website is use fuse.com we have a lot of information on these Clean Fuels programs. On our website, feel free to reach out on our contact form. We'd be happy to, you know, have a conversation, because this money is there for companies to use for electrification, and we really want to make sure that, you know, that money is appropriated to the companies actually buying the equipment. So we're happy to have a conversation. We can give you a quote and walk you through all of the eligible equipment in your fleet. Again, use fuse.com We'd be happy to chat.
Prem Patel (25:26)
Awesome, yeah, some of the best people in the space Connor can thank you enough for coming on and sharing your thoughts. We'll have to get you back for part two when the courts make their decision on ACF, please reach out to fuse and Connor and stay tuned for our next episode. Thanks everyone.
Shana Patadia, Head of Business Development at Synop, the leading energy management provider for commercial fleets
Global giants like McDonald's, DHL, Sysco, and Einride have made waves in the transportation sector by incorporating commercial electric vehicles (EVs) into their fleets this year. While these moves align with sustainability goals and the push for cleaner energy, they introduce new challenges, particularly in developing the necessary infrastructure for charging these vehicles. Unlike traditional gas and diesel fleets, EVs require investment and planning to establish access to charging, adding complexity in terms of cost, time, and engineering.
Many fleets are eager to transition from traditional fuels to electric vehicles to meet their sustainability goals, ESG missions, and comply with government regulations. However, they often face constraints such as initial capital needed for a large transition, access to power, and suitable real estate. For those looking to accelerate the transition and reduce initial capital expenditure, the sharing economy offers innovative solutions to these challenges.
The sharing economy has a proven track record of disruption, as seen with Airbnb's asset-sharing approach, which transformed the hospitality industry and was subsequently applied to transportation through companies like Uber. Today, startups like Revel are integrating passenger EVs into the sharing economy, demonstrating the potential for similar innovations in the commercial sector.
Considering the extensive infrastructure needed to support the commercial EV transition, could a software-supported sharing economy help sustainably accelerate adoption? Leveraging shared resources to overcome the financial and logistical barriers that fleets face might offer a viable path forward.
There are a growing number of companies applying the principles of the sharing economy to the world of commercial EVs. One example is Forum Mobility, which offers a subscription model for charging stations and EV trucks. This service lowers or eliminates the initial investment for fleets looking to speed up their EV transition, especially in a state like California which is home to both the world’s first ban on diesel truck sales and one of the most concentrated logistics centers in the world. This business model allows the cost to shift from upfront capital expenditures for the fleet, to operating expenses.
Beyond lowering barriers to entry, a shared approach will also lower the number of interconnection agreements in the queue. Because large charging stations quickly multiply the required energy load in any one location, utility companies have to make investments of their own like new transmission lines, which take ten years to build on average. At the same time, US utilities are contending with high-polluting baseload generation such as coal-powered energy sources being taken offline faster than renewables are coming online – an additional complexity for the grid to balance.
Instead of several independent depots being built by fleets, all requesting power, the shared approach would mean a fraction of the depots needing power and able to meet the needs of a range of fleets with complementary route schedules. Going back to the Forum Mobility example, their Port of Long Beach project is being designed to charge over 200 trucks a day at full capacity, which is far more trucks and kWs than most fleet operators are currently working with. All of this also means that the same infrastructure is able to get much higher utilization, inherently lowering the $/kWh installed.
Concentrating more power to one location can be mutually beneficial to both fleet operators and utilities when it comes to cost savings and faster deployments.
In order to avoid the aforementioned interconnection wait times, small, privately-owned chargers for passenger vehicles have incorporated lithium-ion battery banks to make fast charging possible without a higher-voltage connection. Similarly, large, shared charging depots will want (and need) more control and independence from the grid. The best method to achieve this is to incorporate battery storage and renewables like solar, which in turn can relieve an already strained grid.
This would consequently serve as a win-win for local utilities who are already facing a backlog of nearly 12,000 projects, 95% of which are for solar, storage or wind interconnections. According to the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory, 1,570 GW of generator capacity and 1,030 GW of storage capacity are waiting in the queue. In short, utilities have enough on their plates as it is, so consolidating projects can lend a proverbial hand.
A recent example of a commercial charging depot leapfrogging interconnection wait times can be found in the Denker Avenue Depot launched by Prologis. According to the warehousing giant, they were given up to a two-year wait for the project from the utility. To speed up this timeline, they developed a microgrid that incorporates alternative fuel generators and an 18-megawatt-hour battery bank.
Though the dependence on natural gas may make this example “imperfect,” the net gains of hundreds of EVs being on the road in place of 100s of ICE vehicles is promising. It also serves as a strong illustration of how the sharing economy can serve as a stepping stone to a more sustainable future as greater efforts are made to strengthen the grid and incorporate renewables.
In a recent analysis, consulting firm Rystad Energy reported that data centers and electric vehicles in the US will represent 290 terawatt hours of annual electricity demand by the end of the decade — or in other words, enough electricity to power Turkey for a year. What this analysis lacks, however, is nuance around the different ways in which data centers and electric vehicles use power. For example, EV load can often be shifted to match grid needs and both charging infrastructure and vehicles are increasingly being designed for bidirectional energy flows, or vehicle-to-grid (V2G).
Thus far, V2G has largely been an experiment, but summer’s heat waves have been an excellent study in its future potential, especially in the case of school buses due to the large amount of downtime built into their schedules. In collaboration with utilities and fleet operators across the country, in June 2024, Synop helped deliver just over 15 MWh of energy back to the grid during peak demand hours. Across a couple summers, that is over 55 MWh sent back to the grid from school bus batteries, without any disruption to the school buses main function.
Implementing this technology, however, is complex, costly, and comes with systemic challenges, including the lack of regulations and standardization. Aside from utilities making investments in the technology that makes V2G possible, many questions remain - how do we gain more insight into the real grid needs and better align with that? How should energy be priced? How can these signals best be sent and utilized?
Large scale depots could play a key role in helping discover the answers to those questions. The tremendous amount of energy made available through the combination of several commercial EVs and on-site battery storage could make V2G impactful on an unprecedented scale. It would also be far easier to manage if coming through a centralized site rather than multiple, small-scale connections. Considering the many threats extreme weather alone makes to the stability of the grid, a powerful, localized center of support could be life-saving.
As the EV industry continues to grow, it will increasingly find itself sandwiched between significant energy needs, outdated or overtaxed utility infrastructure and power generation, and incentives and mandates pushing progress. Incorporating more sharing-based solutions may be the win-win solution for fleets and utilities to address critical infrastructure and cost barriers. It can also offer more efficient and resilient means to strengthen the grid. Though the path will not be without its challenges, the ethos of collaboration that is central to the sharing economy will be key in forging toward a more sustainable future.
As recently as 2020, there were around 10 EV charging hardware manufacturers that were prominent in the US. Since then, a handful of notable players have either left the market, merged, or wound down their business, while 100+ new companies worldwide are now targeting US EV customers. Add to that varied capabilities like V2G, Inductive charging, pantographs, simultaneous dispensers, take-home fleets, etc, and you end up with a tremendously complex and changing EV hardware landscape. In the ever-evolving landscape of EV fleet management, the best hardware decision is to plan for uncertainty and change.
We see the massive opportunity that exists for software like ours to help our clients feel confident in their charger decisions and weather the sometimes tumultuous storms of an emerging technology. Hardware-software interoperability is one of the greatest pain points facing the EV industry today. This is particularly true for commercial EVs where fleet operators want the flexibility to mix and match providers for various business needs, while not sacrificing ease of use and performance. While OCPP compliance is a significant step forward, it’s not a cure-all. When winter temperatures drop to -20 degrees and chargers become unresponsive, operators require enhanced integration between partners and a higher level of coordination, especially with drivers arriving in just a few hours. The last thing we want is a driver stepping out into the freezing cold and realizing their vehicle is not ready to go
For this reason, we’ve developed the Works with Synop program to support fleet operators on their road to EV adoption, regardless of which hardware or telematics software they use.
The Works with Synop Program is our answer to the problem of interoperability. We work deeply with integrated partners in order to break down the silos between fleet operators, hardware, and software. We collaborate with EVSEs and telematics providers to go beyond the surface level, set new standards of partnership by establishing well-defined support channels along with a coordinated and tested approach on any firmware updates, and delivering on a seamless depot experience.
In short, The Works With Synop Program ensures your hardware and software work together seamlessly to optimize your uptime and keep operations running smoothly as you scale. Synop currently integrates with over 26 EVSEs and more than 90 hardware models. The Works With Synop Program consists of partners in that list that want to work closer together, including BorgWarner, Zerova, Power Electronics, and Samsung. With the combination of our large integrated list and certified Works With Synop partners, choosing the right hardware provider no longer has to be a stressful process.
With each of these partners, we conduct thorough integration testing at our Charge Lab in Brooklyn NY or remotely allowing us to go further than just the basic certifications and ensuring compatibility with real stations. Beyond this initial testing, we also have a direct line with charger OEMs and telematics to provide additional support, and we collaborate with vendors ahead of time on firmware updates to minimize any necessary downtime. Our SIM cards can even be pre-installed prior to shipment, making the time to deployment as fast as possible.
Overall, this adds up to a smooth onboarding experience for those just getting started while also ensuring fleets can scale safely, knowing they’ve got the added security of transparency and support among trusted partners.
Adopting a new technology that requires significant investment in infrastructure is no small decision, and no one wants to be left in the cold due to forces they can’t control. The beauty of being a software provider in the beginning stages of this transition is that we have the tools to help solve the inevitable bumps in the road, making this journey easier and more accessible to those in their electrification journeys.
Want to learn more about Works with Synop and how we can help you select the right providers for your EVs? Contact us and we’d be happy to support you.
At Synop we have a daily front row seat to the power of data and the role it can play in revolutionizing fleet operations, especially for mixed-fuel and EV fleets. But as the saying goes, great power demands great responsibility. For this reason, we made it our aim to achieve a SOC 2 certification, and we’re proud to share today that we have met this goal.
SOC 2 (System and Organization Controls 2) certification is a standard for managing customer data developed by the American Institute of CPAs (AICPA) in accordance with five key principles: security, availability, processing integrity, confidentiality, and privacy. There are two types of SOC 2 compliance:
Synop has achieved SOC 2 Type 2 compliance, demonstrating that our security policies and procedures are not only well-designed but also consistently effective over time.
For Synop, achieving SOC 2 Type 2 compliance means we have proven our ability to implement and maintain robust security measures continuously. This accomplishment underscores our dedication to safeguarding customer information and maintaining the integrity of our services. It provides our clients with the assurance that we take data protection seriously and are equipped to handle their sensitive information with the utmost care, consistently.
With SOC 2 Type 2 compliance, Synop can confidently engage with businesses that require strict security and compliance measures. This achievement not only enhances trust with our current and potential customers, but also opens up new market opportunities where SOC 2 compliance is a prerequisite for partnership.
If you’re looking for a reliable and trustworthy software partner to help you begin or scale your EV fleet operations, we’re proud to say we’ve got the credentials.
As the transition to wider commercial EV adoption continues, fleet operators are in the middle of hardware evolutions, changing mandates, market disruptions, and more. For this reason, it makes sense for fleet managers to work with several providers when it comes to vehicles and chargers in order to meet their unique needs and operate their businesses. On the other hand, when problems arise, the multiparty nature of EV operations can make it difficult to get to the bottom of the issue and find a timely solution.
Luckily, Synop can provide the necessary data and leverage built trusted relationships with partners to uncover the root cause and pinpoint a resolution. This case study highlights how Synop worked collaboratively with Thomas Built Buses (TBB) and Delta Electronics to help Kerlin Bus Sales & Leasing deliver fully charged school buses to the drivers of Monroe County Community School Corporation in Indiana.
The depot has 20 2-dispenser, 100kW Delta City chargers, which charge 23 Class C Jouley buses. While the chargers had ample power to recharge the buses rapidly, drivers were reporting that when they arrived at the depot at 6:30 each morning, the buses’ batteries would often be as low as 90% or less State of Charge (SoC) and not actively charging.
To ensure drivers were starting their routes with fully charged vehicles, Kerlin personnel began a daily routine of arriving at the depot at 5:00 in the morning to unplug and replug the buses from their chargers in order to manually force a “top-off” charge.
But as the 2023-2024 school year progressed and the weather got colder, this pre-dawn routine became increasingly challenging. Moreover, Kerlin was concerned about reduced efficiency in the buses if they had to begin driving while their batteries and Battery Management Systems (BMS) were cold. In November 2023, Kerlin approached Thomas Built Buses for advice on how to improve their operations.
Based on the specific use case, the Thomas Built Buses Infrastructure Consulting team recommended Synop Charging Management Software (CMS), to optimize charging. When Synop came on board, the first order of business was bringing the chargers online as they weren’t networked at the time. By providing 4G SIM cards and engaging with Delta Electronics’ leadership, electrical contractor, and Thomas Built Buses’s Project Lead for Commercial Charging, Synop was able to configure the chargers to communicate with the Synop platform over OCPP.
It was then through the Synop platform that Kerlin was able to gain clear visibility into exactly what was happening overnight. Each bus’s battery would reach 100% SoC relatively early, typically before midnight, and the charging session would end. Rather than hold the charge, however, the bus was still using energy in standby mode, something all electric vehicles do to some degree, and thus the batteries were not fully charged in the morning.
To address the issue, Synop worked with Kerlin to implement managed charging strategies, such as site limits that would slow charging until 1:00 or 2:00 in the morning. This led to longer-duration sessions that would end in the early mornings, and in fact many buses had higher SoCs at 6:30 am now with Synop than before. Through continued iteration of site limit lengths, Synop was able to make incremental improvements, but Kerlin were still not able to get all of the buses to a 100% charge at exactly 6:30am.
Unwilling to accept less than a full battery at the start of the bus drivers’ shifts, Synop engaged Delta and Thomas Built Buses to determine what was causing the charging sessions to end when the buses reached 100% SoC. Synop had ample evidence that the EV was not exhibiting any abnormal charging behavior with Other Charger being monitored on the Synop platform, so it seemed likely there was some interoperability issue at hand.
With all hands on deck, Synop retrieved charging logs from the chargers over OCPP, while an electrical contractor downloaded low-level diagnostic files from the chargers themselves and shared these with Delta. Delta engineers analyzed the files, agreed that there was a way to keep charging sessions ongoing when the buses reached 100% SoC, and began working on a firmware solution. Meanwhile, Synop remained in contact with Delta and provided Kerlin with regular updates on when the firmware would be ready.
On January 23, Delta provided Synop with an updated firmware file, and Synop loaded this to the chargers over-the-air. Immediately, the charging sessions began remaining active indefinitely. After the buses reached 100% SoC, the chargers would drop to about 1kW and periodically increase to around 10kW for roughly 20 minutes every few hours. In this way, the buses were able to replace any standby losses.
As a result, buses were full and warm in the morning, and Kerlin no longer had to send someone to the site at 5:00am. They were also able to remove the site limits that had previously been put in place as a compensation measure.
The new firmware also led to two added bonuses. Firstly, the chargers, which had previously been very intermittent online, remain stable in their 4G connections. Secondly, the chargers can now send Synop the OCPP tags (MAC addresses) of the vehicles, allowing Synop to match charging sessions to bus numbers, which will enable more tailored charging management in the future.
Through persistence, collaboration, and Synop’s software insights, interoperability issues can be solved.
After attending the Advanced Clean Transport (ACT) Expo a couple weeks ago where over 12,000 clean transport stakeholders gathered and reflecting on a variety of recent conversations I had with customers, partners, and investors I wanted to highlight a few trends and observations.
While there has been quite a bit of noise in the media and from auto OEMs, and a bit of softness in the medium- and heavy-duty fleet market, it’s still a matter of when for an EV hockey stick, not if.
There are numerous factors that are leading to slower than expected adoption including interconnection delays, funding deployment delays, vehicle and infrastructure supply constraints, funding delays, or regulation litigation. At the same time, vehicle prices remain stubbornly high for a variety of reasons. However, in any technology disruption that is as big as EV (and the infrastructure that goes along with it), these types of growing pains are inevitable. It was never going to be easy. What gives me confidence in the inevitable transition is that the EV technology is superior to ICE vehicles, the cost of the vehicles will come down as supply chains and manufacturing scale, and the funding and regulatory politics will follow based on customer choice and superior economics Whether the true “hockey stick” in adoption is 2024, 2025, or 2026 I’m not smart enough to say, but I do believe it’s still driven by TCO and infrastructure buildout that will happen. The tipping point will come and this period of transition will be a footnote.
Though I mentioned the softness of the medium- and heavy-duty market, light-duty fleets are also in a transitional stage, but for different reasons.
Some of the growing pains related to corporate fleets include capex constraints, trying to work out whether telematics or chargers are the best way to manage reimbursement, and/or waiting on the CCS/NACS conversion to sort itself out. But just as with medium- and heavy-duty fleets, what we do know is that corporate fleets will go electric as the cost of EVs come down.
The fact remains that EVs are a superior technology to ICE vehicles, and these growing pains will be in the rearview mirror soon enough.
The recent shakeout in EVSE hardware highlights the need to avoid being dependent on one manufacturer and underscores the importance of interoperability and hardware agnostic software for both telematics and charging. From Tritium to Freewire to others not public yet, hardware exits are happening left and right, which is part of any technology transition. Ensuring your EVSE manufacturer is OCPP compliant, diversifying your vendors, and having a plan if they go away is paramount when choosing a hardware partner.
Additionally, on the telematics side, providers have different motivations and timelines to support data feeds that are integral to charging optimization. Because telematics providers still have the golden goose of ICE vehicles, surfacing information relevant to EVs, whether from the most basic of SoC or more granular like HVAC usage, is not their greatest priority. Therefore it’s imperative to choose a telematics provider wisely, and not necessarily be dependent on any one provider. In this way fleets can maintain leverage to ensure telematics suppliers are advancing their roadmaps at the speed the industry needs.
Because interoperability can make or break the success of EV fleets, selecting charge management software is the most critical decision point in a fleet operator's electrification journey. Furthermore, not all charging management software is created equally.
A charging management software that is great at integrations and has the capabilities needed to seamlessly manage an EV fleet should be the first decision point for any entity managing chargers or fleet EVs. It is worth noting that for cost conscious operators, a CMS is the least expensive part of the value chain that also enables a customer to diversify the most expensive parts of the value chain, which also happen to need the most maintenance – vehicles and chargers.
We are also seeing our fleet customers need an increasingly robust toolset from their CMS. It’s not just managing chargers and vehicles anymore, it’s managing onsite generators and storage, integrating with ticketing or O&M providers, managing reimbursements for take-home vehicles, and managing subscriptions for depot, amongst other use cases. Building out these capabilities is time intensive, and at Synop we started at the depot management level and have worked our way out from there. We’re confident our all-in-one platform, which ties together vehicle management, charging management, energy management, and payment management, is equipped to service the needs of any fleet operator, from the lightest duty augment to the heaviest of heavy duty.
Technological disruption can often start to feel like cultural overhaul, which is never an easy road, but I’m confident that the bumps are smoothing and we’re heading towards a clean energy future in commercial transportation.
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